I came across a pretty funny little bit in the book I’m reading. (The title of the book is うっかりの日本語合ってるようで違ってる!)
「日本そば」や「日本茶」の日本はいらない
「そば」といえばそば粉で作る麺のことに決っています。ところが、ラーメンンを「中華そば」などというために「日本そば」なることばが生まれました。これは中華そばとまぎらわしいときに使うことばで、一般にはたんに「そば］というほうがすっきりしています。ただ、ラーメン屋に「日本そば」というメニューがあるのだったら、なるほどと納得できます。
また、「日本茶］ということばもありますが、これも「お茶」で十分です。さらに、「日本酒」も同様で「酒」あるいは「清酒」のほうがいいと思います。日本人が日本のものに、わざわざ「日本」をつけることはありません。The text in bold is in the original
And here’s my translation, of which I make no promises on the quality (I can’t explain why, but when I read it in Japanese the narrator in my head was Douglas Adams):
The ‘Japanese’ in “Japanese Soba” and “Japanese Tea” isn’t necessary
We use the word “soba” because it is a noodle made from soba (buckwheat) flour. However, it came to be called “Japanese soba” to keep it from being confused with “Chinese soba”, another name for ramen. Generally speaking though, you can simply use “soba” without any problems, with the exception of dining at a ramen shop where they might have a “Japanese soba” menu, in which case you will be able to fully grasp the implications.
There is also the term “Japanese green tea”, but it is sufficient to simply call it “tea”. Furthermore, we have “Japanese sake” which, in the same way, I feel that we can just call “sake” or “refined sake”. It isn’t necessary for Japanese speakers to explicitly attach ‘Japanese’ to Japanese items.
It’s kind of like calling a kimono a “Japanese kimono” instead, or going to eat “Japanese sushi” instead of just ’sushi’.
5 Comments
September 28, 2007 at 10:33 am
There are also loads of English words that suffer from the same redundancy problem. (And some English words have the same problem, too.)
Great excerpt.
September 28, 2007 at 6:48 pm
>ラーメンを「中華そば」などというために「日本そば」なることばが生まれました。
よく考えれば、「そば（蕎麦）」と「日本そば」の「そば」は違う意味だよね。ラーメンを「中華そば」と呼んだ時から、「そば」には「そば粉で作る麺」という意味から、「麺」というupper categoryを表す語になったということで。誰が書いたか知らないけれど、superficiallyに単語を正しい／間違ってると決めることは重要ではないと思うけどね。
>日本人が日本のものに、わざわざ「日本」をつけることはありません。
日本人が日本のものにわざわざ「日本」をつけるというのはすごく国際的だと思うけどね、「相対化」という意味では（”relativisation”で合ってる？）。
September 28, 2007 at 7:52 pm
The book is attributed to the 日本社 オリジナル series, だいわ文庫, under the company 大和書房? I can’t read book credits very well in Japanese. It looks like it was a compilation work of several authors, though.
I can see applying “Japanese” to items from both sides, and I don’t think the average Japanese speaker thinks about it either way. It’s just the way the language works. But, when translated into English, it comes off as very strange, and I’ve had to train some English students to break the habit. I’ve never really given it any thought when speaking Japanese myself, and actually I find it quite normal. (Like using the word 日本酒 - I learned the word just like that)
September 30, 2007 at 3:20 am
Actually, I think outside of Japan, it may become kind of clearer to use “Japanese sushi”. American sushi is quite different in many ways. Or, at the very least, we can take the time to say “American sushi” when we are not talking about the original… But wait, what is the Korean perspective on sushi? I hear it kinda originated there…
September 30, 2007 at 10:10 am
I hope sushi didn’t originate in Korea, because it isn’t good at all. The way I hear it from Koreans, sushi came to Korea from Japan.
I think we would call Sushi in the States “American-style sushi”. It is definitely not the same as sushi in Japan.
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